Day 114 - 04 Apr 95 - Page 03
1 MR. JUSTICE BELL: No, the one you produced a copy of to
2 Mr. Rampton.
4 MR. MORRIS: Yes, I have extra copies for yourself.
6 MR. JUSTICE BELL: No, just give me the date of it. It was
7 first published in 1984. It is called Report on the
8 Welfare of Livestock (Red Meat Animals) at the time of
11 MR. JUSTICE BELL: Do you have the reference in the report which
12 you would suggest the first sentence of that subparagraph
13 refers to?
15 MR. MORRIS: I have marked up a number of references in the
16 report. There is a whole section -- it basically goes
17 through the slaughter line from unloading to the lairage
18 and the stun pen to the stun and the bleeding. That is
19 basically it. There are quite significant references
20 throughout the report. It is based upon their own
21 observations of the conditions in 1983/1984.
23 MR. JUSTICE BELL: That is the first question then. The second
24 question is to what extent you wish or need to put any
25 parts of the report to Dr. Long which is the most immediate
26 matter because, for instance, so far as that part of the
27 leaflet is concerned, I could imagine that the situation
28 might have arisen that sometime, hopefully before you gave
29 evidence yourselves, you would have thought to give some
30 kind of notice that the British government report referred
31 to in the leaflet was not so far among the bundles of
32 documents and that here is a copy.
34 I think one of the -- I am trying recall now -- reasons
35 I may not have got round to mentioning was because
36 I thought it was a document which already was in the
37 bundles somewhere, but which I had not been particularly
38 referred to or in support of the allegation which is made
39 in that sentence of the leaflet.
41 Since you have now given Mr. Rampton a copy, and it is
42 going to be some considerable time before you do give
43 evidence, there is absolutely no reason, subject to
44 anything Mr. Rampton wants to say, why you should not say:
45 "Well, the recent British government report referred to
46 there, we believe to be such-and-such a report" because,
47 although a stage may be reached where one has to say: "No,
48 we cannot have any more documents coming in late in the
49 day", it does seem to me at the moment to be a bit daft to
50 say, however late it is: "You cannot tell me what that
51 report is". Once you have told me, of course, I have to
52 look at it, or may want to look at it, to see whether that
53 sentence is right.
55 But all this is just thinking aloud because you do not need
56 Dr. Long as a mechanism to do that. You have got Dr. Long
57 in the witness box and you actually want to ask him about
58 things he has observed and which are his experience.
60 MR. MORRIS: Yes. There were certain things I wanted to put to