: Stoller: Odd.
: Don: Not when you realize that what I oppose is government use of force (except in defense from outside aggression, and as part of a minimal justice system). It does not matter to me if the government uses force to keep me from working, keep me working, or contribute to the benifit of widows and orphans. It's still force.
: What world are you living in?
: Government---or business, little difference---IS force, the force of one set of property relations upon another.
Don: The difference is substantial. The buisness down the street isn't going to have some sturmtruppen break in my door. The government might. I don't have to buy what the buisness sells or give them money if I don't want their product. Not so with the government.
:To advocate a society where there exists no government is to advocate a classless society.
Don: I see no reason why a class system would not exist in the absense of government.
:But you're not doing that, are you?
Don: Every so often I start to think it would be nice if there was no government. Then I remember what that would lead to. Government.
: According to your idealistic thinking, America should still be inhabited by the Native Americans and Mexicans.
Don: Yes, if my ideas were applied back in 1790.
:Are you advocating THAT? Or are you merely defending property relations AS THEY STAND NOW---after force has been used to set you up comfortably?
Don: We can't give the land our forefathers took from the indians back. It's not a practical idea, and it would cause no end of hardship. And if we did decide to "make things right" in this manner, where would it stop? Do we go back in history looking for transgressions so we can punish the decendents of the transgressors?
Don: In any case, your "issue" with my ideas is bogus. Otherwise you would have raised an interesting point.