: : Don: Yet healthcare prices didn't seem to be a problem before medicare was instituted. The free market worked fine when it was left alone.
: It was the incentive to over supply regardless of price that was the problem not the cost.
Don: "Over supply regardless of price"!? No, it was because of so-called medicare fraud. Which occured, because the person seeking the services wasn't paying the bill . . .
: : Don: HMOs evolved because of the restrictions the government placed on doctors who recieve medicare payments.
: So I assume the perfectly functioning alternative you are advocating would involve the permanent exclusion from treatment and care of the portion of the population excluded from incomes, or adequate incomes, by the markets inability to provide full employment.
Don: No. It is quite common for doctors to provide reduced-cost and free care to people with low incomes. Several members of my family have recieved free or cheap medical care from doctors--but the quality of the care was very good.
: :The government placed these restrictions because of "medicare fraud"--because medicare by its nature destroyed the natural free market relationship between medical doctors and their customers.
: What if you cant afford care or can only afford a second rate form of care? Then you get workers who cant work etc. not to mention the costs of social disorder or political reaction, they might elect facists or stalinists.
: :I agree that it wasn't a conspiracy. Rather, it was a simple and unpredicted failure of a socialist program--medicare.
: Medicare is too meek, mild and mediocre to be a Socialist program, the fact that you insist on refering to everything that isnt some kind of lassiz faire la la dream as Socialism is proof of the fact that you think there's some kind of conspiracy going on.
Don: No, I simply resent what medicare has done to our health system. It is indeed a socialist (or perhaps fascist) system, but I agree it is a mild one. It is amazing how much harm it has done for such a "mild" program . . .
: :If such a modest attempt at socialism entails such problems, what will larger attempts entail?
: It is more of an attempt at friendly capitalism than socialism.
Don: It isn't capitalism at all. Perhaps you are right about it not being socialism. Now that I think about it it is more fascist . . .