- Capitalism and Alternatives -

I just had to reply to this.

Posted by: Lark on September 27, 1999 at 16:37:27:

In Reply to: ... Would Be As Green? posted by Dr. Cruel on September 16, 1999 at 20:32:35:

: 1) Eco-communism (syndicalism, fascism)

OK let me just stop you right there facism is not a form of communism and it never could be, you can indicate Mussolini's membership of a Socialist party before he thought up Facism (the invention being effectively the bastard child of unchecked upperclass sentiment within the socialist movement EG nationalism and statism) but hey Pinochet thought his military coup and torture and execution of political activists was an act of libertarian capitalism so lets keep individuals out of it.

As far as facism goes it advocates competition the same as liberalism and libertarianism, only sharpened to a complete point with all implements and weapons in the struggle for dominance, including the state, up for grabs. It doesnt ever wish to end this competition but then, once it has been resolved by repression and violence nationally, to carry it on with other nations, sometimes this is even internationalist since racism respects not national boundaries but skin tone etc. but it is not the mutual respect of socialist or communist internationalism.

Economically with a slave class (of political disidents and whoever else is unpopular at the time) to work for even the dumbist and dregs of "ayran" society, the facist is in favour of completely unregulated labour practices, a completely free market.

:/State capitalism - A system of top-heavy, bureaucratically run organs of social management/control (the 'managerial revolution' cited by Burnham in 1943) is rapidly becoming the preferred model of modern socio-political organizations and industrial states.

This is incredibly dated, this managerial revolution stuff, the only people in the left wing movement that still advocate statism and authoritarianism renounce much of what they believe once they have the issues discussed with them.

:They may call themselves 'social democrats' or 'liberal Democrats', but the principles that they are motivated by remain the same. The basic premise is that the people (the masses?) need some sort of 'guiding hand', and that this leadership is best delivered by an all-caring bureacracy made up of these same individuals (who are to receive heavy renumeration for their efforts, of course).

This sounds more like conservatism to me than anything, that is what conservatism is about you know that society depends upon the perpetuation of clever and wise elites.

:Think less about Waco and Ruby Ridge, and more about the modern inner city (whose members frequently depend on these organizations for their livelihood).

I dont know wht this reference is about at all, paranioa maybe? Does it really matter if it is a public or private unaccountable bureaucracy that is delivering the services?

:Corporations, while not directly in favor of these organizational behemoths, recognize the power of these legitimized groups, and are more than happy to cater to them in return for protection. Thus, the Randian "Galt" (corporate interests) meets the Orwellian "O'Brien" (the professional Left).

This is fair enough why shouldnt two Machavellis work together if their aims etc. correspond?

: 2) Why They Like Marxist Ideas, But Hate Marxism - Communism indeed has a bad name, and rightly so.

Well, whether or not communism deserves it's "bad name" capitalism has an equally bad reputation and it definitely deserves that.

:Similarly, just as many people willingly segregate themselves by race and ethnicity in practice, few of these people would claim to support Nazism.

What if I drink in an irish pub because I appreciate my irish identity, false and all as it is, I'm advocating supremist values and ultra competitiveness? The hell I am.

:The same individuals who press forth a distinctive and inherently valuable minority culture as a social good frequently do not give credit to the most voracious advocates of this method of group conceptualization.

Excuse me?

: The other big problem is that Marxists have developed a reputation for "bait-and-switch", i.e. they will propose a good idea, then use it to ask for the most ridiculous commitments and sacrifices from those sold on their bill of goods. In the same way, many people are happy to be nice to their neighbors, and will gladly talk to someone who laments the present climate of coldness in the culture - until they find out that this "someone" is a Jehovah's Witness. One then becomes tensed, presumably awaiting the inevitable sales pitch.


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