- Capitalism and Alternatives -

OK, Gee, You're RIGHT!

Posted by: Barry Stoller on October 28, 1999 at 15:38:35:

In Reply to: holding your hand posted by Gee on October 28, 1999 at 15:01:27:

: But fast is such fun!

I know---just ask this numbskull.

: Yet you deny the one who facilititates the existance of labor-power a 'wage'. Ability may have been of little value alone, but when combined with organised activity may contribute to value - the organised activity is that which enables workers abilities to contribute to value not existent beforehand. Hence the laborer would not be paid for it.

A very old argument, Gee: Labor gets only what it would have earned had the brilliant capitalist not stepped in. That fallacy denies all possibility of worker's associations. Just because worker's have no ability to control the means of production in capitalist society, does that mean they could not manage them?

Only a supremacist would answer no.

: Profit is gain based upon use value...

No, profit is gain based upon exchange-value.

Since SDF just spent a whole post explaining the point carefully, and it's of no use to you, who am I to go over it again?

: But the aspect of value itself means nothing but the use value of a commodity. This is not produced by surplus labor, but by the give-and-take action between the various elements including machinery in the production process. (machinery is variable capital which produces profit.)

No, no, no!

Machinery is fixed and constant capital. Labor is variable capital.

Now it's quite obvious that you haven't even read the first volume of Capital.

Shall I condense the whole book for you? To spare you the need to read it yourself?

: And the aspect of profit is gained by the give-and-take action with consumers in the circulation process...

Back to your 'customer determines value' routine again.

The circulation sphere is where value is realized, the production sphere is where value is created.

Does the cashier 'add value'?

Sorry, I forgot: you think the customer does!

: : Now that I've held your hand for about an hour (instead of reading my new book!), I DO hope you are satisfied...

: I am, but probably not in the way you mean, and there was no hand holding - other way round if anything.

OK, Gee, you are expert in Marx's theories.

Therefore you don't need me to explain any of them to you.

You know you're right and that's that.

Even without ACTUALLY READING Marx.

Go join your right-wing kissin' cousins Doc, DonS, and Frenchy and enjoy their intelligence for a while...

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