- Capitalism and Alternatives -

Do you have it in another color?

Posted by: Gee ( si ) on July 22, 1999 at 15:24:22:

In Reply to: Try this for size. posted by Gideon Hallett on July 22, 1999 at 14:30:15:

: Partially; but since corporates like DuPont, Monsanto, McDonald's, Philips, BP, Shell, Chevron, Total, ICI and others regularly and repeatedly break the law, I don't see the existence of "legitimate" conduits to be a fundamental point; they merely act as partial restraints on corporate behaviour.

They are fundamental - who makes and supposedly enforces 'the law'? Who controls the army and police choosing whom to persecute or not if it is not the sickly conglomoration of govt officials and the protected cash cows who feed them by strangling every other productive person.

: You can't really say "it happens because the Govt. permits it"; it happens regardless, because profit is more important than the law. Check the list of EPA/DOE fines levied on the above for deliberate illegal dumping and pollution; yet those companies go on dumping illegally because of their profit margins.

And the major problem is - no one cares, because no one owns what is being dumped upon (often the sea) its all wishy washy lines on a political map, its not 'in my back yard' because it isnt any ones back yard.

: Historically, corporate tactics have been to dump toxic waste onto ground until it becomes contaminated, then donate it to the general public to save on the costs of cleaning it up. I'm not exonorating politicos in this; they will frequently accept corporate sponsorship in exchange for favourable treatment in trade deals; check Monsanto's support of Clinton.

Precisely. Had the ground not been donatable 'to general public' which seems mean handed over to govt officials they would have what is deserved - worthless land. Only the existence of govt to force US to buy their useless land and fix it up makes this practive possible.

: However, the dominant tactic used by corporates today is not to follow laws that are repugnant to them; or if they do follow them, to employ lobbyists and tame politicians to try to repeal the laws in question.

Not tame politicians, but very very willing ones - looking to slice and dice our money at the end of a gun we were forced to pay for.

: Exactly; so abolish government. That includes unfettered states as well as unfettered corporations; because a cartel of powerful companies is a government of sorts; except that it answers to no-one but the shareholders.

And it cannot exist in the destructive force you describe if it is not able to use willing govt officials to do the equivelent of money laundering - govt is their willing launderer, their protectors.

Follow Ups:

The Debating Room Post a Followup