- Capitalism and Alternatives -

the equality of outcomes rather than equality of opportunity.

Posted by: Capitalist Pig ( Freedom, USA ) on July 01, 1999 at 01:46:51:

In Reply to: You have nothing to loose but your privelleges. posted by Red Deathy on June 30, 1999 at 15:51:07:

: :

: 1:To what extent is market investment replacing bank accounts?

a) A good amount I hope since the return is better, and being in the investment industry I manage that money.

: 2:Can people invest regardless of whether they have successfully sold their Labour power?

Sure, All they need is money. Even the unemployed.

: 3:Could these people live solely off their investments?

Some, they are usually called retirees.

Others, are working towards that day. Is it me or isnt this obvious?

: 4:What is the proportion per head of ownership? i.e.Are most of the shares (and profits) still in the hands of a tiny numbers of millionaires?
Actually there are many millionares out there. Many are average people who invested with discipline in their 401k plans (a self directed retirement plan)

: The answers would show that despite their apparent ownership of insutry, most workers are simply saving or supplimenting their wages with investment.

I thought you asked the questions and i gave the answers.

They are still dependant upon selling their labour power, and their ownership is largely illusory.

Tell that to the workers of many companies for example microsoft, walmart, and home depot who have participated in esops (employee stock ownership plans and are either or are on there way to becoming millionares.

: :The democratization of capital is nearly complete in my country and it is spreading to europe.

: Democratisation? Does everyone have an equal say, or do the rich have the biggest say still?

duh, if you owned 51% of the company would you want someone who had less than 1% to have an equal say. Or to put it in your convuluted thinking if someone invested capital representative of there lifetime worth of labor into a company, should it be the same as someone who put in capital equivalent to only a few hours worth of their labor?

: : The workers now own most large companies through stock ownership. The public already owns the means of production. I don't think they will revolt against themselves, do you?

: Does the majority of the public own the majority of the shares? Or does a tiny minority? Aren't most shares controlled by investment firms, and pensions groups? They wouldn't be revolting against themselves.

No pensions or investment firms merely manage the money they do not own it.

As usual you are obsessed with the equality of outcomes rather than equality of opportunity. Socialism guarantees the equal suffering of all. unless of course you are of the ruling class.

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