: Socialist systems have no government, at least teh type of socialism Lark is talking about. Even for a statist socialist like me, socialism can exist only where the people are the government. Socialism is economic democracy, and is tehrefore impossible in teh absence of political democracy. capitalist systems, in contrast, are thsoe where people do not ahve control over their own labor and produce, since these belong tpo teh capitalist class. Capitalsim cannot eb democratic, saince the means of production are owned not by the people as qa whole but by the capitalists.
DonS: A socialist system without a government would never work. People will always work for their own interest, not for society. Socialism requires a government that can put a gun to your head and force you to work for *it*.
DonS: No modern state is a democracy. In a true democracy, *every* citizen would have to vote on *every* decision. This can't work. Which is the reason we have never seen this system in a nation state.
DonS: The people are *not* the government in *any* modern state. We, the People, are *not* the government. The Founding Fathers of the United States (at least some of them) were smart enough to realize this, and that is why we have a Bill of Rights.
DonS: A system where the people *are* the government cannot exist in a nation state (in a village, yes). So your your vision of socialism cannot exist in a nation state or any large entity.
DonS: In capitalism, the people are the consumers. They control the market by their consumption of products--by their choices. Capitalism is the only system consistant with individual choice and freedom.