- Capitalism and Alternatives -

He did not leave to a better society--he left to a pathetic one.

Posted by: DonS ( USA ) on October 31, 1999 at 17:44:31:

In Reply to: Hitler was helped into office by wealthy cartels posted by Lark on October 29, 1999 at 12:02:49:

: Don your not exactly endearing me to your cause, read this post in the knowledge that if an anti-communist dogmatist like you lived in the same street as me during a popular revolution you'd be the first to the guilotine.

Don: Nice to know you are maintaining your Marxist roots. You probably don't want to live near me. Based on your threats, I'd have to shoot you first and I'm a damn fine shot with rifle or pistol.

: : Don: The above is simply propaganda.

: Bullshit Don, you insulting creep, what do you think I'm brainwashed or something moron? Well if I am, I'm in good company what with the likes of J.S. Mill, Hobhouse, Hobson, T.H. Marshall, Green (all liberals) not to mention Jesus Christ etc.

Don: Your not improving your case.

: :In socialism, the government owns industry;

: Bullshit propaganda again, it's hardly consistant with the libertarian yugoslavian or chez experiments in workers ownership is it? Or dont you know the reason that the tanks roled in?

Don: How do these events alter the definition of socialism?

: :in fascism it controls industry.

: In Facism Industry willfully collaborates you mean!! Hitler was helped into office by wealthy cartels or dont you read anything other than dogmatic revisions of history a la hayek?!

Don: Marxists worlwide have been helped be wealthy cartels. So What? The fact is, in fascism the government *controls* industry.

: :Fascism does not require ultranationalism

: Facism always requires ultra nationalism idiot, it is a brand of nationalism!! Mussolini when contrasting the despotism of Stalin and his own variety said that Stalin used class he used nationality to create subordination and unity both where varients of imperialism.

Don: Fascism is an economic system. It does not carry any requirement for ultranationalism, except in the propaganda of socialists who are attempting to distance themselves from it.

: :and socialism certainly does not require moralism.

: What?!! Go on generalise some more, I tell you what doesnt require morality, moving your accounts of shore to save money when already a fat useless bastard, or moving you business around the world to destroy labour rights and reduce everyone to poverty so that you can live in luxury and compete with your buddies as to who's going to be the fat decadent bastard of the month in the fortune fivehundred.

Don: Based upon what you have said so far, it is clear whatever believes you have do not include morality. You claim to be a Marxist, therefore you can be a Marxist without having morality. QED.

: : : Hell they're just the same really, arent they?

: : Don: No. They are similar, but not the same.

: I'm wasting my breath your to well programmed.

Don: I was thinking the same about you. I know I won't have an impact, but it sure is fun!

: : : Ever been caught between a rock and a hard place?

: : Don: He wasn't.

: Well seeing as you where there, spoke with the man and used your physic and physcological behvaiourist training to determine his motivations etc. your maybe more able to comment upon this than me who didnt meet the guy and has just read secondary sources about the matter.

Don: It is clear to anyone who lives in the West that he could have lived a good life here had he chosen to stay. Perhaps he wanted to be a Big Hero of the Socialised Socialist Democratic Marxist Republic. Who knows. He did not leave to a better society--he left to a pathetic one.

McSpotlight: Don, is there any need to declare that someone has no morality?; it's utterly undefendable as a serious comment (since you can never assign your moral values to someone else) and will merely make Lark see red; which will not help any dialogue towards a useful conclusion...

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